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Posted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 11:57 am Post subject: Custom build questions
I've started my LDP deck build this morning and I've got a quick question. I have the ability to tune where in the deck the flex occurs and how much of a difference in flex there is. Is there going to be any benefit in localizing the flex? The options I've come up with so far are stiff in the middle and flex on the ends, flex in the middle stiff on the ends, flex front and stiff back, or stiff in the front and flex in the beck. I should mention that when I say stiff and flex, that's relative, the deck will be fairly stiff overall. The option I left out of course is consistent flex across the entire deck, but I can't see the fun or challenge in a build like that. I've got until Tuesday to figure this out without halting build progress.
Any input would be greatly appreciated. _________________ I roll my own.
forty2longboards.blogspot.com
So no love yet, my current thought at this point is to put the flex under my back foot since my front foot will be pretty much resting on the front truck already. Maybe vise-versa because it'll fell more solid under my back foot but still have some give from the front.
You may not know the answer for sure but I'd love to hear ideas and the thought process behind them. Theory and postulation welcome. _________________ I roll my own.
forty2longboards.blogspot.com
I would say stiffer on the ends with a little give in the middle. When i find the flex of the deck to be the most useful is when i have my front foot right over the front truck and my rear foot at about the mid point of the deck. When im riding up front only or taking a wide stance, i dont notice the flex much.
That being said, i saw an insect ldp with the back end wrapped in carbon fiber so the front was flexier than the back. Not sure why they decided to that but but ive seen it.
With all that being said, i think most builders are using a uniform flex across the lenght of the board, getting a litle extra flex out of the 'hips' by making that area of the deck a little skinnier (see the mermaid or pulse).
Edit: Oh, didnt realize you were the fourty-two longboards guy, i really like your work. Ill be excited to see how it turns out. Please post some pics here when youre finished.
This is the general notion we followed with the 2005-06 Roe LDP and its follow up Mermaid, the height of camber is the stiffest point and where it levels out becomes the flexiest. Obviously this graphic is a huge oversimplification and exaggeration, not a mathematical model!!
You might think in the top example of having most of the rider's weight over the higher point of camber most of the time, then using the rear foot to jam the back of the board downward to create tension and release energy (the "flexy" point) -- whereas in the bottom example the rider's cruising stance is a little farther back, more of a surf-stance. The natural flex of the bottom example is more toward the nose, but I wouldn't expect the pumping technique to be exactly the same on this board, given the overall stance is quite different-- but the overall effect is the same, the flexy point being toward the front rather than the back of the board.
There have been builders who shave out certain spots or add thickness, even naming the technique "intelliflex", but in some ways this is overthinking the whole thing. With a consistent stiff material, through camber and shaping you can add flex wherever needed.
Back in '06 the Mermaid shape was snickered at the same time it was also celebrated, and several years later, it's stood the test of time. We built the hips into it, and a year later into the Subsonic. Just a few months back Gesmer asked me "why the hips", because it seemed counterintuitive to him (justifiably so) since most other pumpers like those from Indiana or Motion followed the traditional, long smooth side cut for "predictable" pumping response.
The reason was that IMO both Roe and Subsonic had been building their decks particularly stiffer than other makers, and the feedback from racers was pretty unanimous on this point. I figured, why not add flex by scooping out some of the long-straight or convexed rigidity of the outline shape, and give it "hips", since they were going to keep making their boards stiff anyway. The hips also defined the areas of widest foot grip, and with the combination of concave+camber brought back some of the rigidity that was "lost" with the addition of hips.
Thanks for the input, both of you. I'm really excited about this build and I've been thinking about it's execution for over a month now. I'm leaning toward a combination of the two drawings James posted with both camber and flex at the back of the board, and I think my way of doing this will work out really well. I'm not quite ready to give away all my secrets just yet but construction will be somewhat similar to this:
_________________ I roll my own.
forty2longboards.blogspot.com
Looks like you got some good advice.
My only other suggestion would be some wheel wells on the front similar to a Pulse. Wheelbite sucks...HARD!
Can't wait to see the end result!
Hey Fred, How deep are those wheel wells in relation to the baseplate of your trucks? Without wheel wells I'm clearing just over 1/4" and I'm wondering if I really need to cut into the deck more. Also, tonight at 9:00 works for me if you're still up for it. _________________ I roll my own.
forty2longboards.blogspot.com
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