pavedwave longboarding

Moddos · Joined: 06 May 2009 Posts: 14 Location: Europe

Greetings,

I just received a Mermaid complete a few days ago. It's my second board; I've got a badly set up slalom-ish board I bought a few months ago, I never managed to learn how to pump on that, but I was amazed when I could pump right away on the Mermaid. (It's already set up for LDPing, so all I had to do was stand on it and wiggle.)

However, I don't think I'm doing it right. I've read a lot online and looked at a few videos, but I just can't get myself to actually put my weight in my back leg. I noticed that I'm almost always leaning forward (weight on the front leg) while rapidly 'swinging' it back and forth; I do accelerate a bit, but my front leg gets tired very quickly. I replaced my initial bushings with harder ones today (to prevent wheelbite), and my previous technique almost doesn't work anymore (since the truck is a bit stiffer).

Am I right to assume that you really should be doing a fair amount of the work with your rear leg?
I'm currently not using it for anything except slightly shifting weight back and forth (perpendicular to the board); it is my front foot that pushes and pulls the board to generate the force to accelerate.
I noticed looking at videos of people pumping that their board's tail seems to swing back and forth, I believe it doesn't do that for me, and I just can't get my body to put more weight on the back foot while keeping up the movement. Once I put weight on the back foot, I end up just standing still on my board.

Also, I've only been doing very small but fairly fast movements, as soon as I try anything mellower (or if I try to swing my arms along with the movement) I can't get it right.

Am I doing something obvious wrong?
I'll try using slightly softer bushings again, but it seems wrong that only my front leg (mainly the quads) gets tired from pumping. I tried swinging my hips, but since I'm only generating force with my front leg anyway, it doesn't seem to help much Smile

I'll keep trying, but thanks for any tips you might have,

Cheers,
M

LDPanda · Joined: 21 Nov 2008 Posts: 418 Location: Seattle, WA

Welcome!

The pump i think youre describing (the one thats tiring out your lead leg) is the same pump i learned first. Lots of weigh up front and mashing the front truck side to side. It works (at least with softish bushings) but youre right, its not as graceful or efficient as many pumps. Youre on the right track though. First off, it takes lots of practice, dont expect to be pumping uphill at 15mph your first day out (or your second or third). Just keep at it and i gaurantee youll discover a new pump every few sessions. Some pumps are more lead leg heavy (like the one youve already learned) some are more rear leg heavy, some are more driven by the core and upper body. You mention that in videos it seems like the tail is moving around a lot but when youre on the board it doesnt. I found the same thing to be true until a friend taped me pumping and i realized my tail was swinging around too, its just hard to tell. My best suggestion is to find a mild downhill slope, just a few degrees off flat, and practice. The little bit of downhill will give you a better feel for keeping up your momentum and keep you from getting too frustrated. It will also help you get up to a heigher speed pushing and its easier to learn to pump when youre already going pretty quickly. Checking out videos and descriptions and whatnot is great but nothing can replace actually getting out there and trying it.

Good Luck!

LDPanda · Joined: 21 Nov 2008 Posts: 418 Location: Seattle, WA

http://youtube.com/watch?v=6I73I8Jvbhc

I think this is probably the best video to see different styles of pumping. He goes through several different styles including the one i think youre descrbing. There is no one right way to pump, what important is to learn a lot of different techniques and switch it up frequently so you dont tire out particular muscle groups.

stocago · Joined: 14 Apr 2008 Posts: 227

Definitely go back to softer bushings in front. If wheelbite is an issue add a tad more riser.

Be patient. Unfortunately, it'll take some time to learn different pumps. I don't think I can describe what I do. Just practice, practice, practice. You'll know when you get there and you'll wonder why you didn't get there sooner!

If you mention your wedging/dewedging and bushing duros maybe that could help as well.

Moddos · Joined: 06 May 2009 Posts: 14 Location: Europe

Thanks for the encouraging comments everyone Smile

Panda, what you mention definitely sounds like what I'm doing now, it's good to hear that I'm not the only one who started out like that.

My setup is a Bennett 5.0 front truck with a Tracker RTS 129mm back truck. The front has a 15 degree wedge, the back is dewedged by 10 degrees. I use 75mm wheels.

The front has Khiro bushings, the board initially shipped with orange cone, white barrel, (hanger), orange barrel, cup, nut. That turned out to be a little soft, though -- the orange cone and white barrel seemed to be squeezed out of place (the barrel was hanging over the cone on one side), and I think I got wheelbite because of that. This is the initial setup I mentioned which seemed really easy to pump, since the front truck would sweep sideways very easily.

Edit: I'm ~125lb, in case it helps to know for the bushing setup.

So I changed the bushings to something harder -- I added a cup washer at the bottom and used blue cone, orange barrel, (hanger), orange barrel, cup, nut. This is where it seems much stiffer to me, though perhaps it's not the bushings themselves -- they shouldn't be that much harder, I guess...
I noticed that the orange barrel is slightly hanging over the blue cone again, not as bad as with orange cone/white barrel, but still noticeable. I had to squeeze quite hard to get the nut onto the kingpin initially. (The nut is right on the pin, but no threads are showing above the nut, so I didn't tighten it more)

Should I try replacing the second barrel with a (inverted) cone to reduce the pressure on the bushings? Or is it normal to have the barrel slightly hang over the cone on one side?

I can try going to cup washer, orange cone, orange barrel, (hanger), orange barrel, cup, nut -- does that sound reasonable, or should I keep the blue and try a white instead of orange?

I'm not actually sure what bushings are on the back, it seems to be black (might not be Khiro, though) with a rather thin hourglass-like bushing at the bottom (between cup washer and hanger) and an inverted cone at the top (between cup and nut).

Since I'm asking anyway, does it matter whether the upper cup (under the nut) has the hollow bit facing the nut or whether that's facing the bushings? I noticed it's different for front and back truck. In the front, it's x(y where x is the barrel and y is the nut.

Thanks for all the advice =)

stocago · Joined: 14 Apr 2008 Posts: 227

I usually bond the barrel to the cone so that it doesn't slide or flop over.

Maybe you have stock Tracker bushings in back. Maybe go to a slightly firmer bottom bushing.

Also, your change to slightly firmer bushings although noticeable, aren't much firmer, but at your weight, maybe use a white, either at the bottom or top--try both to see what you prefer, but I'd try on top first. If you have a washer under the cone, don't use one. For the top, try a flat washer. Bushing feel is so personal/subjective so play around a lot.

Moddos · Joined: 06 May 2009 Posts: 14 Location: Europe

Thanks for the tips.

What does it mean to bond the barrel to the cone, how do you do that? I assume not with glue =)

I'll keep your back bushings tip in mind; I'll try to get the front setup to work well first (just to keep things simple for now).

Actually, when I replaced bushings first I went from orange/white/orange to blue/orange/blue, I only went to blue/orange/orange now. I thought I did feel a large difference... the cup washer shouldn't matter much, would it? I only put it in when I replaced the bushings (I was recommended to do so), I'll try with/without to see how it changes things. Will also try a flat washer.
Cheers!

LDPanda · Joined: 21 Nov 2008 Posts: 418 Location: Seattle, WA

Actually, using glue to 'bond' two bushings together is just fine, its what i do. Just make sure its a glue that works for plastics (i.e. superglue, krazyglue, etc.). Some people also melt them together with a hot knife or hotplate or something but ive never tried that so i cant speak to it. At 125 lbs Im surprised you found orange,white,orange too soft for you. Im 200 and run blue,white,orange. You might want to try tightening down on the KP nut before making bushing changes but whatever is comfortable for you is best.

It sounds like your rear bushings are stock tracker bushing which are pretty terrible in my opinion. I suggest harder barrel bushings for the rear. Most people seem to like a combination of red and yellow khiros. I personally prefer red venoms but again, whats comfortable for you is best.

Moddos · Joined: 06 May 2009 Posts: 14 Location: Europe

Aah I think perhaps I found the problem Smile

It looks like people generally cut down the Khiro barrel to make it fit the Bennett, since it's larger (Khiro cone + barrel) than the stock Bennett bushing, if I got this right.

My problem was that the white barrel was 'hanging over' the orange cone, that's why I said they were too soft.
Looking around, I see that it shouldn't really be the bushing hardness that is the problem here, since heavier people do just fine with orange and whites. Tightening the KP nut actually made my problem worse! It squeezed barrel against cone even more, so the barrel was even more deformed.

I think if I can shorten the barrel a little, that problem (barrel hanging over) shouldn't happen, and judging by the comments, I should be able to avoid wheelbite even with orange+white+orange. I think the wheelbite was related to the barrel being deformed (one side was hanging over the cone, the other side wasn't -- wheelbite might have been asymmetric too).

This would also explain why the blue orange orange feels too hard for me.

If nobody tells me that I'm doing anything very silly, I'll try cutting down the white barrel tomorrow and go back to orange/white/orange.
Once that's sorted out I'll replace the stock tracker bushings, I've got lots of spare bushings in my Khiro bushing kit Smile

Thanks a lot guys! I hope this'll fix it. Yay pumping Smile

dustm · Joined: 18 Oct 2007 Posts: 37 Location: Raleigh, NC

Keep in mind your wedge angle will affect the feel of the bushings... A flat truck will feel softer than a + wedged truck on the same bushings because the + wedged truck's hangar pivots farther on the baseplate for a given deck lean angle.

So if your truck is mounted near flat I would not be too surprised that the soft bushing combo felt too soft.