New to LDP, searching for an answer

twirlinhippie · New to LDP, searching for an answer

I've read everything I can find on LDP, but I can't seem to find an answer to a simple question. Is there any reason I can't use two Bennett trucks versus a Bennett/Tracker combination? While I'm at it, are the Bennett stock bushings not appropriate for a pumping set-up? I'm 6'2", 190lbs and am considering either an Insect or Roe deck with Retro wheels, as they seem to be a common, preferrred combination. If answers to my questions have been discussed previously on this forum, could I just get a link to them? Thanks to all.

VANILLA GUERILLA

Sorry to post so late. I was trying to let the veterans have a crack at the answer first. Two Bennets would be great for a really surfy feel while carving. But the rear truck would eat a great deal of your forward momentum. To generate acceleration from your own momentum, you'd want a deader truck in the rear so that the momentum you generate from your front almost drags the rear along. Like James says there are many different gears to LDPing. When pumping off the back foot a carvy truck is OK but is still harder to maintain your pace over a longer distance. If you watch the videos you'll notice when James is flying he's barely moving his front foot and core. He's pumping toe to heel so fast the back truck is basically going straight and there's little to no carving at all. It's almost like the front truck is one step ahead of the rear truck (which is playing constant catch up). You can deaden the rear on a Bennet, but Trackers are like 19 bucks and proven to be the best alternative to $100+ precision trucks. There are plenty of places that sell singles of both brands and are easily findable on the front page of Silverfish. As far as bushings, there is no greater item that can change your entire setup. Most of us find just changing one durometer drastically changes our pumping efficiency. Although most of us learned the best starting set up from James, over time every one of us worked to find the most efficient combo for ourselves. Most of us try anything from Khiros to Holeys to Indys. Start with a Khiro "Big Bad Bushing Kit" you will find it's incredibly fun to tinker and test to find the best setup for your self. Again check the gear section for your deck. The insect is Rad but at 5'8" 160 I find it's quite a bit thin for extended miles. It's a blast cutting around the city tough. Getting your entire foot across the platform greatly increases your pumping efficiency over the long haul. And fatigue as well.I hope this helps and if I got anything of this wrong...please chime in.. Justin

twirlinhippie

Muchas gracias Vanilla! I failed to put 2&2 together while reading the stickies on gear, but your explanation has shown me the light. Thanks again.

VANILLA GUERILLA

I'm glad I can help. Nothing is better than coming home from a ride then tinkering to find tomorrows setup.

pavedwave

word, Justin, nicely put! i agree on getting the Khiro bushing kit. the only bushings you might never use from it are the two hardest ones, until you setup a park board or use them as a toe stop.

the famous 'Roe wait' seems to have improved a lot this year, most people are getting their decks in the 6--9 week timeframe? i know there are variances in both directions, i'd like to get a better number on that...

edp_swakakin

twirlinhippie

Vaniila,

While I've got your attention...I understand the reasoning behind the Bennett/Tracker combination, I'm unclear on the size issue. I've read that some guys are using a 6.0/149 combo (I believe). Is that combination and say Big Zigs compatible with a Mermaid or Pulse deck with the appropriate risers/wedging?

mrgumdropman · setup

it is easier to pump with smaller trucks and therefore on a mermaid the biggest you should go IMO is 5.0/126 no bigger even with the roe mermaid

VANILLA GUERILLA

I concur. With a wider truck you get a more carvy feel. And it's also easier to wheel bite. A narrow truck can be used with less risers making the deck height lower and easier to push.

camel

Ok, so I guess I need to put my 2¢ in here since I run 6.0 Bennett's front and rear on my 2k7 Roe Mermaid. My main use is for track work daily. So I run on smooth surface with Lemon BigZigs and ceramic bearings. My front is wedged 19º on an 1/8th inch rise, the rear is dewedged 12º on an 1/8th inch rise. With that much dewedge in the rear, it doesn't wiggle that much. It does kick out a bit, but it gives me the opportunity to use a more stylistic pump rather than always using JP's utility wiggle. I can change up stances and find my way to 8 or so distinct styles that allow me to work different muscle groups and limit fatigue in one particular area. I have found this to be very effective. Now that being said, I typically do 3-5 miles on the track in less than 30 minutes. Interval training if you want to call it that. I have been out on some 20+ mile trips with no ill effects from the slightly decreased efficiency of both the 6.0 and the dual Bennetts. When it comes to true LDP (50-100 miles per trip), a tracker in the rear would be much more efficient. I still like the 6.0 regardless of the loss in efficiency because I started LDP'ing on a dervish with Paris 180's. That was a really funky, double ended, stylistic pump. I really enjoyed getting into the tunes and hammering out the miles on that setup, but it was hard work. What I have now is a median point that gives me a little of both worlds and is dialed in JUST for my style. I can still get to 20mph on flat ground, but it is definitely a sprint, not just a few wiggles like James is capable of.

So there is my 2¢. Hope it helps. If all else fails, you will have a front truck for the next board you get.

Chadd

twirlinhippie

Chadd,

Thank you very much for your two cents! Very informative! It was good to hear another perspective. Thanks again.

pavedwave

camel

I can't keep it there long JP. Basically the straightaways on a .32 mile track. My GPS has shown me where and when I am in that range. Once you are there, if there is not alot of wind, you can hammer through the turn at about 15-16 mph to the other straight and then jam the throttle open again. But again, sprinters don't last. I just like chasing the cyclistas and the maintenance guys on the golf carts for a few moments. They always freak a bit when I pass them. It's quite humorous.

edp_swakakin

To see JP pump is to say the least an eye opening experience. I remember thinking how are you getting that wide of a stroke on a 4.3. When JP starts to pull away, it seems like he was a category 5 hurricane swallowing the pavement. You can literally hear his wheels shredding on every stride. I’m telling you man your current videos don’t do you justice….

dmccoach · Re: New to LDP, searching for an answer

IMHO, The best front/rear for your size is Bennett 6.0 and Airflow 110mm rear - and run 75mm wheels...

I have both the roe and the subsonic and I have tried all kinds of combos - incl. Bennett 5.0 and Tracker and the BIGGEST difference again IMHO - is the Airflow in the rear - it simply sticks best and some how more energy makes it out the back of the deck with these trucks (vs. into a carve with other rear trucks)...

If you can afford the airflow, just do it - don't believe me - pump a deck with a set and another with just a Tracker - better yet race some one then switch boards and take the board with the airflow in the rear - you'll be on-line ordering a set after you get back and before you shower...

And re: Bennett 5.0 vs 6.0 - I have been riding both and I just seem to be able to power stride and maintain a real good clip better w/6.0... with 5.0 I seem to spend too mmuch time wiggling

Best of luck and have fun

pavedwave

Eric, my ONLY regret about that last ultraskate is that we didn't get video footy of you pumpin like a madman! Still kickin myself on that. You've got a buddy down there to ride with now, right? Maybe you can shoot some of yourself soon and we can mix it in with a video here??

As for the "best" setup, I'm just glad to hear different things are working better for different people, because I'd never expect the way my board's all set up to "nail it" for everyone else. Hearing more 5.0 and 6.0 experiments is great. This whole year I've been riding 4.7" in front and an even narrower split fire in the back, which I didn't even realize until I broke a ruler out and checked the wheel to wheel width in rear. This one setup's had well over a thousand miles of commuting time and taken me 400 miles to Canada and Oregon this year. But finally I've had well over a week off, recouping from a nasty cold, and now it's gotten me thinking about changing things up and playing around with trucks and wheels a LOT more again.

Good to hear the airflow is working so awesome. Far as I know the difference between that and the splitfire is negligible.

I'm also starting to tinker again with the idea of a well-dialed Seismic rear... something Pauliwog Howard still rides on his slalom rigs.

Hanael

that'd be me.

...speaking of footage, yeah, we will need some good footage down here..

Bullwings

I've been looking at trying to dial in Seismics too.

Currently running Bennett 6.0 and rts-149. This is probably a bit wider than what most are running, but i like the feel of it.

As far as the seismics, i haven't had time to skate much lately, but something about the springs seems like it would make for some nice pumping. And there are so many spring options too. If i could get a seismic setup going, i wouldn't have to worry about shredding my bushings, since i'm actually starting to see that happening.

using the quick/stable turn combo, with bone-white/light-green springs respectively. I'll post up more if this turns out well. (that'll be in like 2-3 weeks at the earliest). I'm also gonna try out a Bennett 4.3 for the front since i have that on the way for my slalom rig.

edit: splitfires have stop production right now i think. And are airflows really that much better than the rts? what about in comparison to a well dialed seismic stable turn? - just currious. It seems like most people either love or flat out hate seismics, and others don't feel like "dealing" with them.

On that note, anyone try a 125mm randal with a 35 degree base plate? I know this is sometimes being used in GS, but i don't know much about it. I saw all sorts of interesting/modded trucks at Sk8kings.

Bullwings

Update on seismics. Awesomeness.

I'm using 155 stable turn with light green springs in the back. They feel so much better than the RTS 149 that I have.

If you don't have $130 bucks to blow, the Seismic stable turn is a nice alternative.

The quick turn 155 (45 degrees) didn't quite work out so well for me on the front though. The bone white (max-light) springs are still a little bit too stiff for my weight (140 lbs.). I still like the Bennett 6.0 up front.

Hanael

..huh.

i might try that setup then.
seems quite interesting.

how much do you dewedge the seismics?

Bullwings

I don't have any precision trucks, so I don't know how the seismics are in comparison to that, but i liked them over the RTS.

As far as dewedging, it's at 8 degrees. Make sure you get the 30 degree stable turn truck and not the 45 degree quick turn. The springs give you quite a bit of customization to work with - 8 different spring options and the ability to compress or de-compress each spring for added stiffness within each spring option.

pavedwave

I started tinkering with Seismics again, since putting them on the shelf around 2003/04. One of my local slalom buddies has stayed with them as a rear truck, and after a quick revisit, its making more sense now. They're inherently a really stable truck and have a nice snap back to center. The only comparison I'd make at the moment with precision / bushing based truck is that the springs give off a different feel -- not quite as "liquid", but in the rear truck you want a more restricted movement anyway.

Right now I've got one board with a 135 stable in rear, and it's wedged with just one of the soft khiro wedge risers. But the most important thing was trying the Medium green springs -- in the past I think I only had red (too light) and purple (too stiff) and the greens felt better right away.

Sounds like we're in a parallel universe Bullwings Wink

I'm still reserving judgement on the bone white springs in front, because I only tried them too briefly, but right away I thought a little wedge might make a big difference, I'm also at 165lbs so that's a pretty significant difference.

Hanael

hm, that's quite interesting.

I guess i'll get 30' 130mm truck from them to try it out. As for springs...hmm..i hope the shop still got the green springs..

Bullwings

The red springs were way to stiff for me. It was so stiff that when I was pumping, I could feel the rear wheels coming up and losing contact with the ground. I confirmed this when my friend told me that that was exactly what was happening.

There's a chance that the yellow springs (next step down) would have been fine on the softest setting, but right now the light green springs are working for me. I can stiffen them up a little bit, but I don't think i need to. I'm sure my pumps are no where near as powerful which is probably why the light greens work out.

As for the front (quick turn 45 degrees) with the bone whites, they definitely felt more stable and confidence inspiring for carving compared to my Bennett 6.0, but they were tougher to pump and just drained too much energy. Maybe the 130mm would work out better, does seismic sell hangers only? I wish Bennett did.

Hanael

send them an email.
they shipped me a new hanger when i cracked mine.

I guess the spring selection really depends on your weight and preferences..but if it's too hard, it'll be tiring.
I personally run the medium green springs on my garage racing setup, and it works nicely for pumping too.

New to LDP, searching for an answer

setup

Re: New to LDP, searching for an answer